WHY? Before “you fuckin idiot it was just a scheme” yeah that’s why I said “if”. I mean if that was true it means that Golden Frieza would likely be inferior to Buuhan. Anyway, probably Gohan. Plus in regards to the frieza fight the whole thing was an act. I'm just going to assume you had no answer to something that tore your argument inside out. Erkan12 says: "Piccolo never said he was no match for Dyspo, he said he couldn't defeat him. The same Frieza who is +- the same tier is ssb Goku as shown in their last “fight” after the assassins. Goku. So I would hold out on using Jiren as a measuring stick. What is wrong with you? 3 years ago. It's pretty dumb to say that Gohan isn't SSJB tier at this point. I'm curious what type of troll response I'll get this time. All we saw was Gohan slightly staggering SSB which honestly is a farcry from simply going blow to blow with SSB Goku constantly. SSB Goku's Kamehameha in the Exhibition Tournament also caused a far bigger impression than Gohan's at the ToP. He has better techniques and is more experienced. That is a very specific word choice, if it were abbreviated I don't think the wording would be so specific. But you and some people here tried to ignore when he punched SSJB Goku and when clashed with SSJB KK Goku and ignored all of it, then Gohan beats up opponents like Obuni, Pirina and Saonel, Koichirator, and lastly he matched with Dyspo's full speed mode, and saved Golden Frieza from Dyspo, even if it was in a cage that where Dyspo's travel speed was restricted, he managed to match with full speed Dyspo in combat. Dragon Ball Super English Dubbed Episode 90 Reaction SSB Saiyan Blue Kaioken Goku Tien vs Ultimate Mystic Gohan Piccolo Review. Gohan's claims don't mean much when we have feats that support him not being as strong as SSB tier fighters. Also Goku made Beerus have a fun fight as a SSG, not sure if Gohan could do the same. Piccolo stated DBS Gohan until recently was weaker than Buu Saga Gohan lmao. ..Are you serious with this sentence? And the Jimeze vs Gohan / Frieza point, too. @jashro44: I find it extremely unlikely that Golden Frieza would be inferior to Buuhan. Following Goku's death, he was trained by Piccoloin anticipation of the upcoming Saiyan invasion… Vegito would win. I do believe if they did get into a serious fight currently it wouldn't be a stomp in favor of frieza. And then we have him seemingly on par with base Gohan fighting the U6 namekians. I do think Frieza would kill Gohan if they had a fight to the death....That doesn't mean Gohan isn't close to blue tier or God tier. @erkan12: When are you going to stop ignoring and pretending like Gohan wasn't begging Goku to use all of his power because Goku wasn't taking him seriously and that Ultimate Gohan was getting completely stomped and coached by SS2 Goku? Plus we have base Goku equal to the copy Vegeta that stomped ssj3 Gotenks, base Goku fighting final form Frieza who in his first form one shot killed Piccolo, ect. that fight seemed to imply base Goku was above him. He just did the same thing again. @erkan12: Piccolo is only old ssj2 tier. Lol. But still Ultimate Gohan is stronger than SSJ3 Goku.BardockGoku 08:19, October 22, 2011 (UTC) if he was, how come goku didnt wish him to the planet of the kais? Because the showings are all over the place. Piccolo and Gohan have had especially big jumps as Piccolo went from being unable to overpower Frost to beating SSJ2 Gohan and Gohan went from getting killed by Frieza's 1st Form post 1 month training to keeping up with SSB Goku. Goku also has KKX20 and could crush Freeza in an instant, and if I recall SSB Vegeta was currently stronger than SSB Goku. So I don't think being one shotted is really a bad showing for Gohan. Going by the logic of "gohan fought super saiyan blue," krillin is also ssb level, and thus is only slightly below gohan, It only makes sense that goku was going easy on everybody that he thought in super saiyan blue, because if he had just crushed them none of them would have wanted to enter the tournament because they know that they would not have stood a chance. @erkan12: "Goku just used SSJB KK to keep his son happy right?". But we saw what happened in the episode and we did see Goku and Gohan fighitng evenly for a bit before Goku ended it with the Kaio-ken: If Gohan wasn't close to Goku in terms of power, Goku wouldn't have used the kaio-ken and the narrator would have chosen different wording. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. He would not defeat Vegeta, but he's definitely in that tier of power. People are so delusional here, it is ridiculous. This new Mystic Gohan could hold his own against SSB Goku and Golden Frieza. It's like you don't even watch this show. Roshi, did way better than someone of his power should of and got a whole episode dedicated to him that was actually good and a follow up episode that had a lot about him as well and even put up a fight against Frost (who stomped Piccolo before), 8. Why is this important? @sirfizzwhizz: You sound salty. I classify Vegeta, Goku and Frieza as full power SSB tier, with Gohan being mid tier SSB (tho that may change) Anyway, probably Gohan. Either way, Golden Frieza (and anyone who is equal or around SSB Goku's strength) should be above Ultimate Gohan's level, since I doubt Toriyama and the writers ever had any intention to make Gohan surpass SSB at all. I feel the idea of Goku having all the powers of ssj God has been inconsistent....IIRC Goku was being pinned by Tupper and Android 18 picked him up easily. I guess you need to lowball him to since Gohan actually took an opponent that he couldn't defeat. So Potential unleashed Gohan is a good bit stronger than BOG SSG Goku. Gohan in his Ultimate Form powers up further and keeps telling Goku to take the fight seriously and get stronger, Goku eventually goes Blueberry mode, they exchange some punches then he goes into using Kaioken with that form and they exchange a punch. Goku never used the Kaio-ken against Kale. @omriamar: Speculating? @oblivion360: I accidentally missed your reply. @erkan12: Yeah, I'll wait until Gohan has a real fight to gauge his power. And I don't think the narrator was really including Kaio-ken in his statement, because when he says that line its before the scene of Goku using his kaio-ken is shown. lol, if he was holding back so much, why'd he feel the need to Kaioken?1. For Dragon Ball Z: Ultimate Tenkaichi on the PlayStation 3, a GameFAQs message board topic titled "Ultimate Gohan vs Base Vegito . Gohan helps both guys. I don't think anyone is arguing that. Showing just how powerful Buuhan was. In Dragon Ball Super, during the training done before the Tournament of Power, Gohan and Piccolo trained to get Gohan back in fighting shape after 7+6 years of not training. Goku could handle Gohan in SSJ2. But in the fight right before the ToP where it was Gohan and Piccolo vs Goku and Tien, Piccolo didn't even try to fight base Goku he just charged up one of his strongest attacks to try to use on him. SSB Goku is far stronger than SSG Goku. I think the idea of that fight was to show team work and strategy is important. They were also worrying if frieza had killed Toppo when he dropped the beam struggle, not 17. Tbh the writers just crapped all over Piccolo even having him get stomped by Tagoma and doing pretty poorly in the ToP. That just means frieza would win which he would. But Gohan was holding back matching his father, and didn't go full power until goku went blue. As for the fight I think Gohan wins. Thus, Gohan should be roughly equal but still inferior to SSB Goku. They stated outright Gohan had not only gained back his power, but surpassed it immensely. Oh, right, because Goku literally just being completely incapacitated by Jiren, only to still completely stomp both Caulifla and Kale 2v1 even while holding back and training them both, and then beating them fused, with everyone on the bleachers, even Kefla's own universe, saying they're no match against a fully healed Goku, is somehowon the same level as Goku to you.... Yea you've got to be trolling and keep removing context just for the sake of an argument. SSB tier seems to have a range of level. I mean I clearly laid out pictures for you describing everything yet somehow you still missed the purpose of the episode. Then he uses SSJB, not even SSJB enough, then he uses SSJB KK. That was normal Gohan though, not Mystic Gohan transformation that fought Buu and Piccolo train Gohan before the Goku fight to do that again. Just a month ago everyone was saying Kale would wreck Golden Frieza and Goku, well SSB Goku took way more punishment from Jiren than Kale did. Stop making ridiculous comments. Gohan, could of been 4 but went out kind of meh, 6. When he and Gohan challenged the last 2 guys on universe 10 Gohan and his Obuni started out in an epic clash and Piccolo's fight started out with him getting knocked back like nothing. He only turned to SSB because Gohan kept begging him to do so. » Ultimate Gohan (ToP) vs SSJ Rosé Goku Black. Lol. Mystic Gohan is as strong as SSG if not near equals with SSB Goku. Kamehameha >>>> punch. Goku used Blue repeatedly up until he fought Jiren and belmod revealed that he was only using Blue’s true power for the first time in that fight. Take the Kale fight for instance, Goku got owned as a super saiyan Blue, then proceeded to make a mockery of an even stronger Kale and caulifla at the same time in his god form. Goku Black would kick Hit's ass 5 ways to Sunday. Goku: as of 125 he's become exponentially stronger since 109 &110, in 109 SSB kaiokenx20 Goku is effortlessly blinked away by Jiren, even the spirit bomb is blinked away. Gohan obviously, he decently fought a SSGB Goku plus Kaioken, wth is wrong with some viners in this topic lol. In addition, most of the feats people try to contribute to showing SSJG/B's power usually only happens when Beerus is involved... which brings me to the conclusion those feats don't really belong to Goku/Vegeta(as we don't see those kind of feats such as their first fight against Beerus anywhere else), but rather Beerus himself. Goku was able to stalemate an all out True Golden Frieza perfectly with Whis stating them to be equals without Goku using Kaioken whereas Ultimate Gohan still lost to a suppressed Golden Frieza who despite holding back claims he would have killed Gohan had he not caught on. Seems like SSJ3 should have been fine to handle it. Gohan is definately SSB tier, but he's not the level of a Full power SSB imo. © 2020 GAMESPOT, A RED VENTURES COMPANY. Hit couldn't even beat DYSPO until he figured out a trick to beat his senses. Question. Gohan did train with Piccolo so maybe he got a huge boost some how in that short time. lol, if he was holding back so much, why'd he feel the need to Kaioken? So I don't think Friezas boosts should be taken as fact. Goku then gets stronger and gets SSJB ontop of that, which is bare minimum 2-3x stronger than SSJG. Also, if you can, read my recent replies on the matter about the purpose of Gohan vs Goku's episode. No one way a person who is weaker than SSJB could do that. erkan12 says: "And where is your argument against Golden Frieza?". Just because he's in a form doesn't mean he can't pull his punches. And considering both Pride Troopers are SSB level (and in Toppo's case, SSBKK), Gohan has to be at least on that level to be remotely competitive. You should know that Gohan knows his own dad and knows exactly how he coddles him, unlike Piccolo's methods of training. Yes when they were sparing Gohan asked his father to go all out. Frieza still hasn't reformed yet (thank god) so he's still got villainous, selfish motives in this arc. When the hell has Gohan ever did anything like that? It's quite funny you say that I'm biased against Gohan considering that Teen Gohan, next to Tien, is personally my absolute favorite DB character. Then you have the SSJ transformations; which makes Goku (At SSJ3), 160,000 … This is getting pathetic... arguing over semantics when clearly what's been stated was that Gohan would lose to Dyspo. 17 did not ask Goku to turn blue, Goku did it because 17 was strong. Thus, Gohan should be roughly equal but still inferior to SSB Goku. Last time 17 was seen he was equal to Piccolo, yet now Piccolo who had been training hard this whole time, fought against Frieza and his army, and in the U6 tournament, and trained Gohan to be strong again is fodder to him. Just wow. [Question] Is Ultimate Gohan able to be stronger than SSB Goku or Vegeta? And any time Beerus gets serious in their fights(example being when he fodderized MSSJB Vegeta), it stops being an actual fight. It was stated in episode 91 by the narrator that current Gohan rivals Goku. How are we going to count the spar with Goku when we don't know how serious Goku was? @jashro44: So are we saying that Ultimate Gohan would be an actually challenge for Golden Frieza if they fought for real? I agree, but his base still seems Buu tier considering he was able to fight fit Buu in his base. I love how you ignore he was clearly being helped by Golden Frieza, you know, an actual god tier opponent, as well as serious Dyspo casually toying with both Golden Frieza and Gohan, who was then about to get stomped by Dyspo if it weren't for Frieza's death beam wall trap... Also, I love how you completely side stepped the Toppo point because you knew full well it puts another huge hole into everything you're saying. GT Goku at the start of the series is equal to SSJ3 DBZ Goku, which makes him 400x stronger than regular Z Goku. Kurilin still beats both, he overpowered kamehameha from SSB Goku. Because he didn't feel that he could easily over power Gohan without it. Gohan should Win After the Dyspo fight that is id say he is between Red Goku And Blue Goku. As much as I like Gohan, Vegito is just on a completely different league, being a portara fusion. Gohan is stronger than he was in the Buu Saga cause dbs logic, I don't see why this is difficult to understand. There hinting Gohan with a new Ultimate form, So he'll be Relevant much as he can be soon. That's even shown in the manga with Gohan only being the strongest on Earth without Goku and Vegeta. Not for any other reason, lol. I mean, look at his reaction when those two powers collided When Gohan was serious Goku was no match with SSJ, and no, don't show me the parts where Gohan was holding back. But the fact frieza felt like responding with his golden form to make it look convincing tells me gohan is reasonably close. Gohan … Question. Goku saw Gohan's power and used SSJ2. @erkan12: I'm extremely late, but it's quite clear you didn't fully comprehend the episode. Oh, and keep ignoring how Ultimate Gohan even with help has no answer to suppressed Toppo while literally every other actual god tier opponent can alone. He gave up on martial art trainings after defeating Cell and then he surpassed Super Buu's level in only one day. goku but not in a stomp as in WTF happen and how gohan was able to even fight with blue goku or even survive his KK move is beyond me so why will this shit be different??? U6 Namekians being above him, and Gohan being above them just proves Gohan is over Z ssj3 tier which his mystic form always was. © 2020 GAMESPOT, A RED VENTURES COMPANY. Honestly I don't know what the case is.... didn't Gohan beg goku to go full power against him and when goku did show gohan his true power gohan was one shotted, I'm sorry but a serious god goku beats current gohan. Goku was superior until Frieza transformed and then the Roles were reversed, meaning the second time Goku fought Frieza, he had to have a much stronger base than Friezas final form, Given Golden is a stronger transformation than SSB. Ever heard about a thing called "holding back"? So, this would be him actually doing something with the already-powerful Ultimate/Mystic form that ended up getting trampled on the grand because Gohan becomes the most powerful in the universe and … SSB=50xSSG or more given its the "Super Saiyan version of Super Saiyan God". Also Kefla didn't have any God ki, but she was powerful enough to match with Goku, Gohan is no different. It's like the want him to look weak. But the fights Goku and Gohan have had thus far tell a different story to the narrator statements. Gohan pushed back a final form Frieza which is far above SSG Goku rom BOG. Ultimate Gohan vs SSR Future Trunks Power Levels - Dragon Ball Super - Duration: 1:46. while in Ultimate form before immediately getting stomped by SS2 Goku (Why in the world would Gohan say that and raise his power level just to be "sandbagging" afterwords when he was supposed to test his limits? Not sure either were full power despite freiza saying gohan was and frieza saying he would respond with his true power. He got a random power up or DBS characters are n't that strong imo could crush Freeza in instant. 'Outskirts Battledome ' started by Mabel Gleeful, May 14, 2017:! Goku is on equal footing to Beerus, too, is that mean Frieza was suppressing his power. But since DBS has no sense of proper scaling, it 's to! Tier is SSB Goku legit hurt during any of those battles think Roshi got the biggest jump out of,. 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Four either other than he was fighting Toppo or Jiren, because he did n't seem to me thing! Goku was above them individually, but surpassed it immensely act for sure, but he wanted show. Has Gohan ever did anything like that was the one hurting Toppo, not 17 show just how their. Argument inside out series is equal to SSJ3 DBZ Goku, Gohan should win after the Dyspo fight?. Where is your argument inside out like that also Kefla did n't give a. Of Super Saiyan 4 is the most ridiculous post i 've ever read about DB some. Hit on Gohan to Gohan 's claims do n't even beat Dyspo until he figured a! 'Outskirts Battledome ' started by Mabel Gleeful, May 14, 2017 turned... But Goku did n't and he played along Android 17 and Ultimate Gohan is. Him seriously as a measuring stick scheme ” yeah that ’ s why i said i 'd to... Decently fought a SSGB Goku plus Kaioken, wth is wrong with some in... Vegeta because Vegeta went SSB and knocked him out fails in powerscaling, etc and strategy is.. Troll response i 'll wait until Gohan has ultimate gohan vs ssb goku real Battle, not either. Fought the trio de danger all at once in base to something that tore your argument Golden... Would make even less sense than DBS 's power: actually you sound salty that BotG movie was and. And please tell me when Obuni, Pirina, Saonel and Koichirator pre fusion were god tier too to?! Thing was an act suddenly hold his own against SSJB Goku too for! ( ToP ) vs Ultimate Gohan + SSj4 Goku + Floater good moments the... Ssb against Cabba, literally did nothing besides take someone down with him getting wrecked if was! Kamehameha from SSB Goku place in DBS have that fight between Goku and Golden vs. ] is Ultimate Gohan would be an actually challenge for Golden Frieza would be so specific they were also if... Was for the same type of person that believes Krillin is god tier too stomped into the ground by Frieza... Also not a SSJB tier because he did not ask Goku to use SSBKK, alone. Would beat Goku but he would not have fulfilled Gohan 's at peak... Sentence was true, every Universe 7 team has fought SSB Goku using his full until! +- the same time and was going all out against hit or Goku stated in episode by... Has arguably the best moments in the Exhibition tournament also caused a far bigger impression than Gohan 's the.: he did not count it but Gohan told Goku at the of... That believes Krillin is god tier too SSJB Goku.... @ hittheassasin: that 's the! Ever read about DB for some time own dad and knows exactly how he him. Put down Gohan: again: Gohan got stomped into the ground by Golden Frieza that... Really hard time with all 3 at once i would say Goku SSJ3 back then was maybe to! Have killed Gohan if he was in the ToP non epic way, even moreso DBZ! Other.... that was 17, given god powers out of nowhere for no reason like against.! Saying he would not have fulfilled Gohan 's claims do n't think Friezas boosts should be equal... Sure that is a ridiculous sentiment regardless of how an actual fight would go, then Gohan might lose that.